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Lateral Shift with a Quad Mek?
#1
How do I do it?
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#2
Happens automatically, whenever doing so would get you to the chosen destination using fewer MP than regular movement.
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#3
hmm.  Okay. I was messing around yesterday and it didn't seem to be working, but maybe I wasn't trying hard enough.  Does it matter that I was trying to move one hex and maintain my facing (as opposed to having it in the middle of my move)?
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#4
Not really, no. But you have to remember to press the "turn" button to realign the quad to its original facing. Then the whole move should only cost 2MP instead of 3.
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#5
It doesn't seem very useful at all.

EXAMPLE 1
I turn 1 hex, go one hex forward, then turn to my original facing (3 MP, 2 MP with Lateral Movement).

EXAMPLE 2
I turn 1 hex, move forward 5 hexes, then turn to my original facing (7 MP, 10 MP with Lateral Movement).

...in its current iteration, why would you use this? Or is it...

EXAMPLE 3
I turn 1 hex, move forward 1 hex, turn to my original facing, turn again, move 1 hex, return to facing, etc.?
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#6
You shouldn't have to turn at all to use lateral movement to sidestep right or left. There are instances though were you have to manually *HELP* the pathing routine to get it to use the best move possible
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#7
(12-14-2015, 08:16 PM)pheonixstorm link Wrote: You shouldn't have to turn at all to use lateral movement to sidestep right or left. There are instances though were you have to manually *HELP* the pathing routine to get it to use the best move possible

It's still kind of silly. If it cost 1 MP and not 2 MP, then it would be extremely useful. But as it is, it only functions as a bonus for 1 hex of movement. After that, you might as well change facing as normal.
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#8
I believe the lateral movement was meant to only be used to move with small adjustments and not exactly strafing like movement. That is what torso twist is for. However, quads do get a bonus to piloting skill rolls for stability so there are trade offs. And like most things, the terrain in question really determines how useful stuff is, in my experience.
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#9
(12-15-2015, 09:38 PM)Xenon54z link Wrote: I believe the lateral movement was meant to only be used to move with small adjustments and not exactly strafing like movement. That is what torso twist is for. However, quads do get a bonus to piloting skill rolls for stability so there are trade offs. And like most things, the terrain in question really determines how useful stuff is, in my experience.

As quads don't torso twist, this should be their compensation, IMO. And it's truly something you'd never use, except as a one-off joke about crab walking. In-game, it's rarely going to come into play... if ever.

EXAMPLE:
Quad 1 has heavy woods in its adjacent hex. It laterally shifts into the hex (2 MP + 2 MP = 4 MP). If it had to turn first, it would spend 5 MP.

So... are there a lot of quads slower than 3/5...? Maybe I'm just missing it. Where would a lateral shift be an absolute necessity vs. just turning and moving?
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#10
Example: Something is blocking path direct forward.

Quad: Lateral move to L or R maintaining facing... move forward N hexes. Cost 2 + N

Biped: Turn L/R (1pt), Move forward (1pt), Turn L/R (1pt)... move forward N hexes. Cost 3 + N
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#11
(12-16-2015, 01:32 PM)scJazz link Wrote: Example: Something is blocking path direct forward.

Quad: Lateral move to L or R maintaining facing... move forward N hexes. Cost 2 + N

Biped: Turn L/R (1pt), Move forward (1pt), Turn L/R (1pt)... move forward N hexes. Cost 3 + N

But it's not 2+N. It's 2 MP per hex moved laterally. So it's actually 2N.

Turn 1 hex, walk forward 3, turn back to original facing = 5 MP.
3 hexes * 2 MP = 6 MP for lateral movement.
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#12
It's not the most useful movement related ability out there but it does come in handy in some situations where you need to move laterally one hex and continue in the direction you were going. It only saves 1 MP but that could be the difference between generating a +1 TMM or +2 TMM.

It's like the difference between 6/9 movement and 5/8. In a lot of situations, both will generate the same TMM but the 6/9 design can do it more consistently. Lateral movement isn't as flexible but it can still provide that slight movement edge in certain situations.
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#13
(12-16-2015, 02:40 PM)TigerShark link Wrote: [quote author=scJazz link=topic=207.msg14935#msg14935 date=1450287141]
Example: Something is blocking path direct forward.

Quad: Lateral move to L or R maintaining facing... move forward N hexes. Cost 2 + N

Biped: Turn L/R (1pt), Move forward (1pt), Turn L/R (1pt)... move forward N hexes. Cost 3 + N

But it's not 2+N. It's 2 MP per hex moved laterally. So it's actually 2N.

Turn 1 hex, walk forward 3, turn back to original facing = 5 MP.
3 hexes * 2 MP = 6 MP for lateral movement.
[/quote]
In the example, a lateral shift is just being used once.
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#14
Hmm. Would be fun to see this as a house rule...

"Quadrupedal 'Mechs may move laterally at a cost of 1 MP for hexes entered by using Walking MP and 2 MP for hexes entered using Flanking MP."

Example: GOL-1H Goliath uses all of its MP moving laterally:

It spends 4 walking MP moving 4 hexes laterally and 2 Running MP to move 1 additional hex, for a total of 5 hexes.
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#15
I also think that the maneuvering ace SPA combines very favorably with quads.  I think it'll give you the 1MP lateral shift.
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#16
(12-16-2015, 02:40 PM)TigerShark link Wrote: [quote author=scJazz link=topic=207.msg14935#msg14935 date=1450287141]
Example: Something is blocking path direct forward.

Quad: Lateral move to L or R maintaining facing... move forward N hexes. Cost 2 + N

Biped: Turn L/R (1pt), Move forward (1pt), Turn L/R (1pt)... move forward N hexes. Cost 3 + N

But it's not 2+N. It's 2 MP per hex moved laterally. So it's actually 2N.

Turn 1 hex, walk forward 3, turn back to original facing = 5 MP.
3 hexes * 2 MP = 6 MP for lateral movement.
[/quote]

Try reading the above again. This time... pay attention.
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#17
(12-16-2015, 06:42 PM)scJazz link Wrote: [quote author=TigerShark link=topic=207.msg14936#msg14936 date=1450291228]
[quote author=scJazz link=topic=207.msg14935#msg14935 date=1450287141]
Example: Something is blocking path direct forward.

Quad: Lateral move to L or R maintaining facing... move forward N hexes. Cost 2 + N

Biped: Turn L/R (1pt), Move forward (1pt), Turn L/R (1pt)... move forward N hexes. Cost 3 + N

But it's not 2+N. It's 2 MP per hex moved laterally. So it's actually 2N.

Turn 1 hex, walk forward 3, turn back to original facing = 5 MP.
3 hexes * 2 MP = 6 MP for lateral movement.
[/quote]

Try reading the above again. This time... pay attention.
[/quote]

So you're saying, 'shift one hex, then walk forward.' Gotcha. Misunderstood what you were getting across, since I'm not thinking of 'lateral movement' as a 'lateral shift.'

Though I'd still argue that's not very useful.
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#18
I didn't mean that quads had torso twist. I was saying you do that with a biped.

I find quads way more useful in city combat where a lateral shift could mean escaping a pesky PSR cause of slips/trips/falls on pavement. And how many streets just turn one hex and then keep going in the original direction.

Also, I'm a fan of them for ambushes because they can go prone and get right back up with no PSR. Just hide behind a lvl1 hill. "Ya, no mechs there, just level one hills..." Pop AC/20! Big Grin
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#19
Also allows lateral with bipeds I think.

Tigershark
As far as 2 + N vs 2N, I think you are not following the rules correctly. The quad does not turn in a lateral shift so a shift to the left and move forward maintains the same saving as the original starting hex. MM has trouble with lateral movement which could be why you keep bringing up the same example. Also, a lateral shift multiple hexes to the right or left would not be done in most instances unless there is some benefit.
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#20
(12-17-2015, 11:21 PM)pheonixstorm link Wrote: Also allows lateral with bipeds I think.

Tigershark
As far as 2 + N vs 2N, I think you are not following the rules correctly. The quad does not turn in a lateral shift so a shift to the left and move forward maintains the same saving as the original starting hex. MM has trouble with lateral movement which could be why you keep bringing up the same example. Also, a lateral shift multiple hexes to the right or left would not be done in most instances unless there is some benefit.

We were talking about two different things, so there was a mix-up. He was talking about shifting once to either direction, then moving forward.

I'm talking about shifting multiple times and 'walking' laterally. So there is a benefit, but only if you shift one hex then move forward or use it to shift into woods or something without using Running MP.

The problem I see with it is that, logically, a two-legged 'Mech should be able to do this naturally. You're just... stepping to the side. And it does have a hip joint flexible enough to KICK, so... pretty sure it could jut out a few feet and slide over. It feels like 'lateral shifting' should be true 'crab walking', i.e.: being able to walk sideways at the same speed at which the Quad moved forward.
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